Editor’s note: DAVEY D won’t let ERNIE go away on a bitter note.
Ernie,
This is not Hip Hop you’re speaking about. Yes it involves people who came from that culture. And it involves people who have known pretty much only this all of their lives. However, this thing about people living in a time warp and having nothing to show for their accomplishments is a continuum of things that have afflicted our fathers, grandfathers and fathers before them.
We have not learned to age gracefully. And that aspect is complicated by a outside power structure that has pushed relentlessly for folks not to respect their elders.
Once upon a time our elders managed to maintain a sense of purpose and importance by becoming Deacons in a Church or head of the Elk Lodge or some other organization.. We in Hip Hop have never done that… and impacting us is the fact that there is no blueprint.. This is not by accident its by design
With that being said.. lets remember that the war being aged against us never stopped. Collectively speaking, many of us got too comfortable and left our posts. We got addicted to drugs, fame and rich white acceptance so long as we were the only ones in the room. This is not to blame anyone per say, but to remind folks that we are still in a fight and the rule of thumb is as it always has been work twice as hard to get to where you need to be going.
Working doesn’t mean slaving away at somebody’s 9-5 on a corporate plantation. It means to continue making a way out of no way. It means tapping into that spirit that blessed us to be innovative in whatever craft we practice. If any of us have forgotten how to do that then we have lost our connection to God..
Drug addiction is no joke… The first wave of Hip Hoppers got hit with it after the government tried to wipe out our liberation movement with straight up assassinations and heroin. Hip Hop came out of that and demonstrated the potential to pick up where the the liberation movement leaders of the 60s and 70s left off. So this time around they used the art of pimping and seduced many of us into cocaine, crack and reckless behavior that continues to this day. JDL is a victim of chemical and biological warfare.
The people from dipset who seemed to be exploiting him are victims of mind control. In short they are being pimped by a system that has convinced them that they somehow are running things. Should we not be surprised as we watched that video that these gentlemen are following the same ghetto-keep it real script. If I closed my eyes, JR Writer could’ve been the guys who have a similar video who live right next door here in Oakland..
Here’s the bottom-line… We are at War.. so lets learn to truly love and appreciate one another. Lets not forget how to think and out think our situations.. For example, I can only go by what I saw on the video, but I think perhaps a conversation with Writer and Dipset to see if they can help put someone on could yield results.. better yet, maybe someone can inspire them to do something like what Shock G did 15 years ago when he opened up a bone marrow directory. maybe those who are doing well can help set up or support a free clinci where guys like JDL can get help. The possibilities are endless.
Also while Dipset and other younger rappers can have their coattails pulled, lets not forget the real devils, the owners of the labels, radio stations and every other outlet that delivers Hip Hop. Jeff Smulyan who owns Hot 97 owes us a paycheck much more so than does Lil Wayne who is addicted to drugs himself. Clive Davis needs to sponsor an old school boutique label just like they do vintage Jazz which never makes money but gives the labels prestige. Last nighht i was talking with Black Thought of the Roots and he was developing some sort of concept which would allow artists to tour and record for the older audiences that grew up with them. A 45 year old artist does not need to be pretending and competing with a 20 year old..We are past the age of being cute.. War is upon us.. so lets protect our necks..
In the spirit of love
Davey D
This is a good debate. I do believe the new model of hip-hop buisness will usher in an avenue for the independent artist to thrive. However, what type of message that artist will have will determine the relevance of hip-hop for the next 10 years. If the elder statesmen of this genre would step up and provide some type of guidance or leave a door open for the next generation then the next generation will in turn respect their forefathers.
You know what’s going to kill hip-hop? Asking too goddamn much of it.
It’s not a perfect parallel, for a lot of reasons, but: does Jack Johnson’s brand of bland bullshit stoner folk-lite, to name but one example, make Dylan’s early records any less potent? Fuck no. Does Fall Out Boy’s awful ’emo’ ‘punk’ in any way diminish the brilliance of the Sex Pistols or the Smiths? Again, fuck no.
Be glad for what the OG Bronx crews, PE and all the rest gave us. Listen to it, learn from it, savor it. It’s American history, it has changed youth culture worldwide, and while plenty of people involved didn’t get their due and unfairly fell by the wayside, what they created will never be forgotten.
But at the end of the day, it’s pop music (like Dylan, the Pistols, and the Smiths). If it never inspires anyone to find out about Havens, Heron, Garvey, and so many others, or to pick up a serious book, well, that’s because it shouldn’t have to. If you think it should, you’re asking too much of it. It cannot and should not be expected to be any kind of substitute for a library card, a subscription to the Times or any number of serious magazines, and genuine intellectual curiosity (espcially about how power works in our society).
If it sparks that, that’s a huge bonus, and sometimes it can. But there are enough great black intellectuals and writers (and white intellectuals and writers doing thoughtful and interesting work on black America) to handle that end. Leave the party music alone.
Kent Wallace,
I see your point and I agree with you on several levels, but to NOT demand more from the art that you consume is a mistake. It wasn’t until America that art became a pastime in commerce. The whole of human history shows how art was used to inform and educate, albeit in an entertaining methodical manner.
I hold out the belief that art will return to its original purpose and I actively promote the artists that believe this also.
Dallas –
Yeah, I absolutely agree. And a lot of pop music rises to the level of art. I guess I just mean people shouldn’t turn around and condemn the whole culture when a lot of rappers fail to live up to that (not saying this is what you or Ernie did).
The real poets will always shine through (or, at least, often enough). And while you’re waiting for that to happen, sometimes it’s cool to just get on down to the hot club joints and think dirty thoughts about video chicks. Enjoy what’s out there for what it is, do your best to direct attention to the ones who you think deserve it, and don’t worry so much (to you, and to everyone else who is understandably down on hip-hop from time to time.
Meant to close parenthesis. And that last bit goes for me too.
This is a great post Dallas. Big Props, I owe you a drink for this one. People tend to forget that there is a war always going on against the minorities of this world. I am not however making excuses for any of the “hip Hop Heroes” who lead us astray each day. We must unite and try to understand each other to take the next step towards something greater than ourselves that our children will be able to reap the benefits of. I know I’m semi rambling but I felt inspired…
What up PMD fam?
Kent Wallace,
We should always enjoy the shine of the sun and a cool breeze and a fat booty with a big set of tits(no Rick Ross). That doesn’t mean that we forget or downplay our real needs.
Some artists can help us do both.
…i like The Smiths
I call BS on this feeble Negroe victim rationale. I’ll gladly expound when I’m not checking from a mobile device. But I’ll get the “No disrespect to the established writer and documentarian Davey D but… ” out of the way.
Sorry for the delay…
I was with Davey D’s response up until he said that “it was not accident, it was design”. When are we gonna stop with the identification or creation of excuses and move on to working on solutions? When I say solutions, its not the messianic waiting for “someone to come along” and exact some change. It is the need to do for self and get yourself in check and not prescribe to the “victimhood of alleged warfare”. This is not fly in the face of the notion of the stacked deck which as a American Negroe I know exists, but we’ve spent the last 40 years identifying/complaining this notion.
I take issue that there is a need to wait on someone else to come along to cure the ills of a people. The problem is that, and history will prove is that these “deliverers from evil” are often bogged down by the people they are attempting to save because they merely latch on rather than empower and add on. (I shudder at the possibility that a Negroe president would actually make us lazier since he’d have the biggest coattails to ride.) That’s the problem I see with some of the rhetoric here. As tragic as it is to see JDL in his state (I watched the video you speak of), I also saw a man who when the camera was on was giving all he could at the moment with the hopes of some reward at the end. Lets not get all altruistic about what hip-hop is. It is a music form and it is a business. It is not a community group, a fraternal organization, or even a gang. These things all have a support structure of some form that provide the necessary give and take and disciplines that allows continuity and protection over time. In all actuality to follow common lore, hip-hop sprung out of individuality, bucking the gangs of the 70’s, and it was just people who wanted to make some lemonade out of the lemons of life.
So no-one doesn’t owe any one jack shit under the banner of “hip-hop/Hip-Hop”. Lets not confuse “Hip-Hop” as the code for “Black Community”. The ills that cause the generational “horrors” (please) of the JDL/DipSet interaction has nothing to do with Hip-Hop and who owes what to whom. Its about the responsibility that men have to themselves, to their families, and to the babies. In taking care of that thats how you build the foundations of the community and foster strength and continuity. Quit waiting for some label to come out as a pension plan, and all these other “owed” hand outs. Its about taking advantage of your time and what you did with it in setting up the next chapter of your life. I played college football and almost made the NFL, and my alma mater and their athletic department, don’t own me a goddamn thing, but I know I got what I could when I was there, and its helped me proceed and continue in life.
Too often we’re caught in the siren song of what we had and where we were and use that to blunt the force of where we’re going or need to go. The future can be a rough place, and holding on to the past for the sake of security merely arrests your development. I’ll use a personal DP.com reader as an example here. The homie Combat Jack – CJ saw what was happening to the opportunities in his ‘hood and decided to get his and make it happen. Was it easy? Hell the fuck no, and CJ can comedically convey the harsh realities of what it is for us, but ultimately he’s getting his and setting the example for his seeds and hopefully trickle down to others. Instead of bitching about white taking everything he took his and now rents to them. This is what MEN DO. Unfortunately Hip-Hop is filled with too many males and not enough men.
40-Excellent, smart, angry, hip and dead on response. Much respect. Ernie
There is no Hip Hop Culture. That is the truth, period. Every Culture has all of the things I referred to in my letter. Every Culture has a spiritual or religious central core and a social, political and economic base. The Mayan, Aztec, Native American, Buddhist, Muslim, Tibetan all had core principles. Hip Hop is at best an art form, a multi faceted art form. Art is art and Culture is Culture. This is not my opinion it is fact. This is not semantics it is science.
As long as we look to art, rappers, dancers, painters or musicians for answers to Cultural problems we will always get the wrong answers.
Rap at best addresses issues and puts them in the forefront of our awareness and consciousness. It does not, has not, will not, cannot provide solutions. Solutions take action, unity, economics and political power.
As long as you look to the wrong thing for right answers you will always get the wrong answers. To compound matters Rap has been colonized, bought, sold and paid for and is basically the new slave auction block. Without exception every rapper who is getting any shine at all is being used for the genocide of their people
Jay Z-American Gangster-Big Pimping
Snoop- promoting weed and pimping.
50 Cent-the most negative, anti life rapper that ever lived
L’il Wayne
Dip Set
G Unit
Tupac-Thug Life
and on and on and on.
Dallas Penn (www.dallaspenn.com) writes:
“Rap music is so often contextualized next to professional wrestling. Mostly because the blood and beefs are faked and the rampant steroid use. I never found myself interested in women’s wrestling and I think that sentiment rings true for people listening to rap music in 2008. Rap music has shifted culturally from embodying art to representing sport, and not even graceful sports either. Most rap music nowadays grunts and bumps its head into the wall. Rightfully so too since most fans say they listen to rap in order NOT to have to think.”
Sit with the Mothers who have lost sons at the hands of wanna be thug life, gangsta, shitheads.
Nuff said. Peace, Ernie
It amazes me to sit here in my corporate cubicle and be really enlightened, and to a certain extent nearly intimidated by, the wit, wisdom, and overall mastery of the english language that all of you brothers have been employing in these related posts.
Ernie, I can “hear” the pain with which you speak in being very dissapointed in both (many of) the forefathers and the grandbabies of the hip hop genre.
Dallas you provide and keep active such a great forum here at the site. I remember I thought your site was all about wild screen caps from pron flicks, LOL. I feel your stock rises as you move away from lowercase xxl.
Combat Jack is like an internet celebrity persona, from his top unknown hip hop stories, to the mad respect he garners from you northeast types that know of his accomplisments personally. I’m honored that he took the time to make light of the fact that I shroomed out in college and found myself crying to some ‘Pac music. (Like really to the subject matter, not the fact that he passed over/on).
Again I was almost scared to respond in fear of not adding anything to the table, but y’all are dope.
One,
dame from the bay
Peace to Ernie, Dallas, Davey D, CJ, the homie JR (revolutionary journalist), the RBG’s ( as someone who grew up listening to Askari X, I chuckled when Stic Man refrenced them on the Nigger mixtape), The Mighty Zulu Nation (of which I attended weekly meetings for a year or so when I was in highschool in SF), and all the THINKERS.
Thanks Ernie…
Ernie, I take the ‘obnoxious’ thing back; I was trying to be an Internets Tough Guy. I didn’t so much agree with what you were on in your post, but your knowledge and passion pwns mine; you’re a giant in the culture, and I’m just some fool on the webz with a corny pseudonym. Apologies and respect.
But in a lot of ways I thought you sounded a little too much like the rightwing culture scolds who are always on Fox News, AM hate radio, and shit like that. You claim that 50, etc. are being ‘used for the genocide of their people’; if half of what they rapped about was even close to being true, that might be a fair point. They’re all derivative anyway, but the shit they’re ripping off checks off at least one of the boxes that qualifies something as art: it is/was a real emobdiment of the anger and nihilism that is justifiably a fact of life for a lot of black America.
Old news: the reason people try and claim that it’s destructive, and the reason it sometimes actually is destructive, is the result of deep, deep problems in black America and American society as a whole that existed long before Eazy ever greased up his jheri, and would persist if every rapper magically turned into an aspiring Teddy Pendergrass tomorrow.
Pop music can be an immense force for social change, but it has never been and will never be more than just one piece of a very large puzzle.
Every crumbling high school with leaky plumbing, tenured teachers who don’t give a fuck, and textbook shortages produces more ghetto casualties than every rap record sold in the past fifteen years.
Entertainment in our culture will always be materialistic, oversexed, violent, and completely divorced from reality. And pinning too much blame on it for anything – whether you’re a reactionary or a radical – will always be futile.
Um, I probably should have just amened 40’s post. Cause it’s about a million times better than mine now that I read it sober. Well said.